**FMS02** Now I can't target the sub UL

They're the rules you want to target to override the rules being inherited from the parents. Alternatively you could do:

#navwrap > ul > li and #navwrap > ul > li > a to make sure that the styles for the top level menu only apply to the first level items and their anchors.

Many thanks Tyssen - I'll try that and see how I get on.

I'll be back if I'm still foxed - could have sworn I'd tried #navwrap li li

Okay...I tried the ones in your heading - #navwrap li li and a

Some progress...it's now normal not bold but will not take the line height - in fact seems to be adding the 2em of the UL to the 1em of the li li

You've specified line-height on #navwrap li so you need to override it on #navwrap li li, not #navwrap li li a.

No, it's coming from somewhere else. I did that and in fact I've just taken the line-height out of #navwrap li to prove that it's not overriding #navwrap li li

Where could it be coming from...a default on the UL?

Did you realize this is adding 30px vertical space to each line?

#navwrap li li {
    color: #000000;
    line-height: 1em;
    padding: 15px;
    text-decoration: none;
}

In Firebug, select the element of interest, and click "layout" in the right panel.
cheers,

gary

Rofl! No, of course I didn't realise - if I had I wouldn't have driven myself near crazy this afternoon!

*shaking head* After all my "padding-left"s...to be tripped up by that. Some detective work you master trouble-shooter you

Ahem...I've had it open permanently - scouring the inheriteds - it obviously doesn't help. I even SAW the blue border around the li and STILL didn't trip to it.

Thank you sooo much Gary - I tips me hat ter yer.

Not everything comes that easily. Just remember I've been fixing other people's html and css for about eight years now. I can't do graphic design for …, but I am a fair to middling fixer.

cheers,

gary

Fair to middling nothing...your track record tells the tale

I must also thank Tyssen for narrowing my focus to the right area, I really did feel it was a small leap to finally get the text "normal" at least!!

And believe it or not , one of Hugo's lessons from long ago did stick a little "the #xxxx IS the first UL you don't have to specify it again". But they're still tricky little devils when you're not writing them all the time.

Thanks guys.