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dvdljns
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I need a book on tables. One that explains tables as they are used today and deals with using css with them.

I went to borders and found a book on css I liked and one on dreamweaver mx but found nothing that really helps me move back to tables.

Does someone know of one or will someone write one so I can buy it.

drhowarddrfine
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Quote:
nothing that really helps me move back to tables.
That makes me wonder if this is a troll question. You won't find any books on designing with tables because it is not a proper design method.

IE7 is 10 years behind the standards or wrong.
But it works in IE!
IE is a cancer on the web -- Paul Thurott

dvdljns
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thepineapplehead
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good God man, get with the times! NO-ONE uses tables for designs any more.

Here's why, from the aptly titled: Why Tables for Layout is Stupid

http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold

Verschwindende wrote:
  • CSS doesn't make pies

Anonymous
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Re: tables

Come on, give the guy a break. I mean it is possible that his pages will merely display tables and tables of data. Laughing out loud

drhowarddrfine
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What about tables of tables?

IE7 is 10 years behind the standards or wrong.
But it works in IE!
IE is a cancer on the web -- Paul Thurott

Anonymous
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drhowarddrfine wrote:
What about tables of tables?
If the tables are tables of data and the tables of data can also be considered data then, yes!

drhowarddrfine
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Well, how many tables can a table hold if a table can hold tables?

IE7 is 10 years behind the standards or wrong.
But it works in IE!
IE is a cancer on the web -- Paul Thurott

gary.turner
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Says who.
From your citation;

Quote:
Tables should not be used purely as a means to layout document content as this may present problems when rendering to non-visual media. Additionally, when used with graphics, these tables may force users to scroll horizontally to view a table designed on a system with a larger display. To minimize these problems, authors should use style sheets to control layout rather than tables.

If you have problems with tables used in their proper structural and semantic purpose, bring them to the forum. If you are having problems with your tables as a layout method, you're likely not to find much sympathy on a css forum.

cheers,

gary

If your web page is as clever as you can make it, it's probably too clever for you to debug or maintain.

dvdljns
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I have a feeling I am missing something here I can show you just as many websites built using tables as I can using divs. And css can be used to control them both.

lordelric
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A table can hold as many tables if a table ccan hold tables

thepineapplehead
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dvdljns wrote:
I have a feeling I am missing something here I can show you just as many websites built using tables as I can using divs. And css can be used to control them both.

We're not debating the fact that CSS can be used to control tables, we're debating the fact that it's stupid to use tables to layout a page.

Verschwindende wrote:
  • CSS doesn't make pies

drhowarddrfine
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I can show you just as many websites built using tables
A lot of people do things using old methods but that doesn't make them right. If you use tables, you will regret it later.

IE7 is 10 years behind the standards or wrong.
But it works in IE!
IE is a cancer on the web -- Paul Thurott

ragamuffin
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Life is a process of becoming, a combination of states we have to go through. Where people fail is that they wish to elect a state and remain in it. This is a kind of death. - Anais Nin

dvdljns - Why are you wanting to remain in the past? Technology is constantly moving forward, you cannot stop it...either get on the bandwagon or step-aside. I myself have chosen to stay current with the trends and techniques of web design...if I don't, I am out of a job.

- r

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ragamuffin wrote:
Quote:
Life is a process of becoming, a combination of states we have to go through. Where people fail is that they wish to elect a state and remain in it. This is a kind of death. - Anais Nin
Ooh, you so classy. *chews gum* Laughing out loud

ragamuffin
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Does someone know of one or will someone write one so I can buy it.

If you insist designing with tables, I will be nice and help you out...I found this on Amazon.

Quote:
Creating a Power Web Site: Html, Tables, Imagemaps, Frames, and Forms (Paperback)
by Gail Junion-Metz, Brad Stephens

I should mention that it was published in 1998.

- r

thepineapplehead
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I got my smileys back!1!!1onetyone

Verschwindende wrote:
  • CSS doesn't make pies

lordelric
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I have to agree with the group so far. I made the change to table-less design at the beginning of last year and it has been a lot easier to build and maintain sites, and being a lazy person at heart I prefer to work smarter not harder.

lordelric
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It is funny one of the top stories right now on digg is this

http//www.digg.com/design/Going_Tableless_Why_CSS_Should_Be_Used_For_Layouts

Here is the blog entry

http//sitening.com/blog/2005/11/07/going-tableless-why-css-should-be-used-for-layouts/

dvdljns
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Ok!

Now it is just for the sake of discussion, because I found a way to do it with divs. I will still get blasted for my method of doing it, but until someone shows me a better way, this is the way I am doing it.

To start out with, delric, that article goes something like this:

Tableless: why css should be used for layouts. look around the web sometimes, there are plenty of websites that are built using tables that use css.

I agree divs are easier to learn. But I disagree that it is a better way. Just a differant way.

But back to the question I came to ask. On my images a lot of them have many of the same property's - like for instance, they are same height and length - also, since they are in a row, the top is placed at 92px across my page.

Am I right in thinking that I can build a class that has this repeating stuff in it and call it on all the images and only put the stuff that is differrant in a id use the id on each image?

Chris..S
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dvdljns, that of course is your perogative. It isn't what this forum is about. If you really wish to learn the ins and outs of designing websites with tables, here is not where you will do that. You can argue and rail against that, but in the end your efforts will be futile.

The opinion here (be it right or wrong) is as explained by earlier posters - most eloquently by kk5st - and in my opinion very clearly setout in this presentation

Technology and techniques move forward. Layouts created using <table>, <tr> & <td> are in the past. The paradigm may return once the IE6 hegemony is over - when we can reliably use display:table-cell, display:table-row, display:table as CSS properties on any element. Until then designers who wish to separate presentation from content - which is what CSS and this forum is all about - won't be using tables or table like properties to layout their designs.

thepineapplehead
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dvdljns wrote:
Just a differant way.But back to the question I came to ask. On my images a lot of them have many of the same property's. like for instance they are same height and length also since they are in a row the top is placed at 92px across my page. Am I right in thinking that I can build a class that has this repeating stuff in it and call it on all the images and only put the stuff that is differrant in a id use the id on each image.

Yes Laughing out loud

Verschwindende wrote:
  • CSS doesn't make pies

lordelric
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I agree that if you choose to use tables for your design it is your choice. You will, in my opinion, find out how difficult it can be, if you use tables, when you have to change your site.

dvdljns
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What is the right way to right this link.

div class="navbar" id="home"><img src="images/home-tnav.jpg" alt="image"></div>

It does not work this way. the stuff in my id works but not the class .navbar

Hugo
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First of all it's not a link, and secondly without seeing the CSS rules sets and selectors(the important bits) how can we tell?

Post up the pertinent snippet of CSS.

Hugo.

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