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RH
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*friendly stuff*
Since I have just registered first of all let me say "Hello to everybody and good evening".
*/friendly stuff*

This is the css-site I've just finished.

I would be glad about comments, critics and advise.

Known issues:
1.-site: FF displays the words ("WORK" and "POOL") just a bit too high what makes me wonder since other positioning in FF is just fine and using the same type of css
On http://www.ro-edel.de/seiten/pool.html the distance between the ">>" and "WORK" above right shows like none, but should be a little bit.

It is optimized for Safari, the above mentioned FF is also on Mac.
IE on windows doesn't get the menu right: it displays the colors meant to be underneath the words just right of them and (of course) doesn't get the fly-out-stuff.
It's one of my first steps in CSS and I haven't got the possibility to check many browsers so I'm thankful for help.

Btw the CSS is here, here and here.
There is existing a fourth one, but since it's working properly I don't want to overload Smile unless desired.

Winger
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Re: New here: hello and asking for check

It's a joke - right?

All I see is a page full of coloured circles!

Winger

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Not a joke - more of a mystery tour. You have to hover around the page (doesn't work in IE) and it brings up links (on the opposite from where you hover) to get to other parts of the site.
A think from an experiment, whimsical point of view it's OK, but from an actual practical, usability point of view, I don't like it at all.

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Disco? Smile

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Blueprint
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Or you can just tab straight to the link...

http//www.chemicalscripts.com/
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Hmmm, the Pool page would likely give someone an epileptic seizure, if this is a serious site I would tone down the cleverness.

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As probably covered it's clever BUT if this is supposed to be a usable site for getting information out to people I would change the whole thing. Even being forwarned that it was a bit odd I still had no idea what I was meant to be doing to get off the front page. It will just infurate people i'm sure.

Other than that if it's an exercise in oddness then you have achieved great results Laughing out loud

One odd thing, if i hover to make Work appear, then speedily swish mouse over the actual work work, it stayes there and I can't get to pool!

Anonymous
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This is a really strong example of Mystery Meat Navigation. Shock

but this is simply awesome: http://www.ro-edel.de/bilder/work_frei.gif

Laughing out loud

RH
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Hhhm, maybe this forum's a good example for MMN since its name is "CSS-Forum" but people around here simply just compete in being silly. So thanx a lot for your really helpfull CSS-advise!

You were so entertainig funny, I will miss your company ...

Anonymous
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I guess you don't want honest opinions. Sorry, friend, we are not here to stroke your ego we are here to actually help.

As it stands, from a usability standpoint, I can't see anyone sitting around trying to figure out what to do with your site. My first instinct is to close the browser window and move on.

Even though the file size was too large I did like the art on the link I listed above. Too bad it is hidden under your mysterious web design.

Hope you stay.

RH
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OK, maybe some misunderstanding, can happen. Maybe I didn't get the CSS-messages in the posts above? Please show me ...
Since this is a CSS-Forum for the moment I am not willing to discuss my point of view of usability. Ever thought that it could have been some purpose in creating the site this way?
Again: I don't need people to understand this, I can live with it that people laugh about the site the same way I laugh about a lot sites I've seen in this Forum.
I was calling for CSS advice and didn't get it, so what should be the use in staying in this forum ...

Blueprint
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Correction: You actually called for:

Quote:
I would be glad about comments, critics and advise.

The guys are giving constructive critisism... I took alot for my site too, but I acted on it and hopefully it's better.

Your site is unique, and that's definately something to be proud of. Unfortunately I'm not as much of a CSS guru as some others here, so I can't really give you much feedback.

Blueprint.

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RH
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Yes, I followed your thread and it encouraged me to post in this forum.
I also consider your site being very personal what I like very much.
I know (as I stated in my first post) that there are problems in navigating (nothing for my ego this point, be sure!). In my opinion testing sites depends on communities like I thought this one is (or was).
Up to now I could'nt get anything usefull though of course I like it if people point out that they love the artwork of the artist (which by the way is not me ...). Thx for that, I will tell her.
But again, it's not about the ego-thing, just about some CSS ...

I forgot, you're right, also the critics point: I like critics. I have gotten the point that the front-page navigation isn't really worth naming it. Though some people really liked it (those who for example like playing Myst what doesn't mean that my site is even part that good Wink ). I'm gonna work it out of course.

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RH wrote:
Hhhm, maybe this forum's a good example for MMN since its name is "CSS-Forum" but people around here simply just compete in being silly. So thanx a lot for your really helpfull CSS-advise!

In your attempt at being a [email protected] you came across as competely arrogant and foolish.

Mystery meat navigation is where you do not know what to click to find the thing you're looking for.

This forum could be classed as "flagrant mis-advertising" as it claims to be something it's not.

Sorry, but I really don't like sarcastic comments when the members here are trying to help you.

Get over yourself, it's a horrible flashing background that gave me a fit. Evil

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  • CSS doesn't make pies

Chris..S
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Touchy thread Smile

My comments:

- in some places you use ">>" in your html content. Its a good idea to use the html entity (>) instead. Its likely to keep code highlighters happy and it would make any future conversion to XHTML easier.

- if you turn off styling, the site is perhaps too bare bones. Without styling (say browsing on a PDA or phone) the site loses its impact and lacks some helpful tags to tell you where you are ... though possibly thats down to my not understanding the language used. Because of the sparse nature of the content, it actually works very well on a small screen (try it in Opera small screen mode to see what I mean), far better than most sites.

- apart from that its striking. I take it you have considered your audience, presumably from the reactions created by those who have responded above me, its unlikely to be them. Hugo's point about some warning before being dropped onto the main site is sensible.

This forum isn't just for providing CSS advice/criticism. Stand your ground and explain back to us what you are trying to achieve with your site. If the design decisions are concious ones and they have taken into account "normal web constraints" then you're fine and good luck.

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When a site is posted for a check, then it's really as a completed entity, a whole, encompassing many aspects of web page construction that aims to deliver a usable viewing experience.

In all honesty when I look at a site the last thing I am at all interested in is the CSS despite that being 'my thing' thats just a means to an end, the visual aspect of the site is always the first thing that would grab attention and focus and evoke criticism or praise. one would then probably be thinking about the content and the navigation as of primary importance (still could not really care less about CSS) I would now probably be looking at the source markup (far more important than markup) I would only then consider the CSS if aspects of of the page would be improved directly by tweaking that code.

So you see a site check is never going to really focus on a single aspect of a page unless you specify that it should.

Apologies if you felt the responses were harsh or unwarranted, but as Chris said stand your ground and discuss the matter, but do not just run away.This forum is somewhere where you will get some first class advice and help on CSS coding and other aspects of web design for that matter.

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Blueprint
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Yeah Chris's reply was awesome, he put everything into one post. Your site isnt *beep*! This site is *beep*!

It's not how you fall to a response, it's how you "bounce back" and get back up onto your feet that counts.

I'm sure the guys here feel the same, we're not "flaming" you, we're merely giving out point of view. If i say I like your site, it doesn't mean EVERYONE has to... it's just ONE person's point of view.

I like your site for its uniqueness (if thats a word)

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Blueprint can we find a different word than cr*p to describes someones site!, you may not like it, they may well think it's the pinnacle of web design and be hurt by your description.

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And you don't want to piss someone off who has such easy access to a large array of guns! Shock

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Anonymous
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Tyssen wrote:
And you don't want to *beep* someone off who has such easy access to a large array of guns! Shock
Well, they're just air guns (but those still hurt like crazy). Smile

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Chris..S wrote:
Shock

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4317423.stmYeah, That's why the air gunners use full protective gear when competing. Those pellets travel fast and can cause trauma.

Terrible and sad story. Crying

RH
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OK, you got me Smile
Blood is down today (I hope) and let's see what the points are (and if there are).
Important thing: sarcasm, which I know is even face to face hard to identify so should not be used in letter-communication. Point why I was using it was, that i couldn't get something out of the answers except: the navigation don't work in IE (which I knew only partly as I stated in the first post.). Safari and FF make the nav a lot more fun to discover. The pool-site could cause epileptics, thx for that hint cause I didn't think of that and it's something serious.
Maybe because of language probs or maybe because of my brain I felt like getting no clear answers except for those mentioned above.
To not waste time: I agree with Chris (thx for the entity-hint!) and Hugo.
Next point: the design of the site was made by the artist, what I maybe should have explained in my first post. Since her art is something she wants people to explore it, she also wanted her site in that style, this way she developed the navigation. So it's perfectly OK if people don't get the way ... it's not made "for the masses" and also not to infuriate people.
Prob with the front-nav nonetheless is that it doesn't work right in IE, so we have to think it over, though some people using IE liked the flickering-effect Wink

So please keep on "feedbacking" ...
Within the next weeks we're gonna rework the site when the points are clear and the decisions how to improve are made, I'll have another try here (what I hope to have ...)

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So it's done now, if you like please take another look at ro-edel.de.
Thx

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You get a horizontal scrollbar on your index page in Firefox. Also, on the home page for work, I think you need something inside the black box before people click on the links and load the relevant content into it.

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briski
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There is also a very slight mis-alignment with the pool cicles in FF on PC that causes little dashes to appear above earch circle - See attached.

RH
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Yep, the circles should be OK now ...?
The next days there also will be something for the black square.
Also the scrollbar should have disappeared now?
Thx says
RH

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Yep all looking good now Laughing out loud

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well, you still have a couple of validation errors you might want to look into.. other than that, from a technical point of view, it looks fine.. now artistically, i can surely say i've never seen a website like yours (and i don't mean it in a bad way).. it defies all logic for navigation, presentation and layout.. i applaud your originality, as this doesn't look like a website done by a bad designer, but i just can't say i like it..

to say the least, it's visually disturbing.. if your goal was to induce seizure episodes and paranoia attacks, looking too long at this page will surelly acomplish that..

i understand you're dealing with a different audience that may have a different artistic inclination than the rest of us, but no matter what your art likes and dislikes are, you can count on that page to make your eyes hurt.. and i'm not sure any web designer would want that for their visitors, if nothing because you're selling a service and want to attract customers..

visual oddities aside, and as others have mentioned, you need a better navigation system.. when i went to your index for the first time i had no idea where to click or what the hell i was even looking at.. only after wasting around 10 secs (and being very close to not even care about figuring it out), did i discover 2 links in there.. the next step was actually figuring out where these links take me and what exactly is the site about to begin with! a very high percentage of people won't even consider going further into a second level of a website they know nothing about.. they would much rather just close the page and find alternatives..

i suggest letting the viewers know from the first page what the site's about and what they can expect inside.. to make an example, imagine a site with a picture of a chicken as the first page and link, and then have that page linked to a porn site.. it's just not a pleasant thing to be surprised (no matter how appealing the porn is!)..

another thing i noticed is the lack of a standard design across all 3 pages.. you have circles with a weird thing in them on the first one, the "work" section has a minimal black box and a few links, and the "pool" section has the color changing squares from hell.. neither one follows the same theme.. maybe this is something you were looking for, but it should be pointed out..

i hope you don't take this the wrong way.. just my thoughts.. take care.

//edit: you censor "p*rn"? jeez. :?

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Ok forgetting about the fact that it MY eyes hurt and now that you've explained it was an design based on an artists concept.
There are a few little bits to mention

you page
http://www.ro-edel.de/seiten/leben.html

doesn't fit, the 'fan?' graphic at the bottom sits half off the page on my FF (maybe on purpose but just pointing it out)

The epilepsy things is a worry, especially without warning (i think there's actually a law about that)

Also the navigation - is there ant reason that you can click it from two places - with a gap between them? (try tabbing to see what i mean)

Just for any one whose eyes hurt too - try turning off the background images - i like that!

BTW - don't get offended, i think you just confused everyone from the start. It took a while for people (me included) to get past the oddness before they could even look at the structure for any errors.

Freddy

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